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Country Roads Alpacas

395 Posts

Posted - 02/05/2008 :  1:01:28 PM  Show Profile  Visit Country Roads Alpacas's Homepage  Reply with Quote
All joking aside now. I know he wouldn't want me to write this but I am anyway.

Shenoah Farm Alpacas, http://www.alpacanation.com/farmsandbreeders/03_viewfarm.asp?name=12477
just lost a 3/4 Accoyo full Peruvian male to a neighbors Pit Bull. He saw the dog there and payed no attention to it thinking it would not come back after he ran it off, and he didn't want to hurt the dog. The next day, his wife called him at work to tell him the dog came back and got into the pasture and literally took the head off an outstanding male of theirs. She shot at it and scared it off. The muzzle was gone and the hide and ears were stripped off the head leaving nothing but a muzzle-less skull and eyeballs. Their top full Accoyo stud had his legs chewed up also. He came home and put the scalped and muzzle-less male down. The next day, he stayed home to find the owner of the dog. The dog showed up again to finish the herd and he shot it with a shot gun, but the dog ran off and it is uncertain the bird shot did any real damage. He found the owner of the dog whom he said told him someone stole the dog and that he was so gentle that he would not harm a flee. The guy is said to have tore the please report up and attacked him as he was entering the vehicle and kicked him in the neck. He said the police knew the guy from the fire department and that he was a nice guy. They said it would only be a misdemeanor and not worth pursuing.
Folks, coyotes are not the threat. It is the neighbors pets. You can not allow them on your property. In an effort to help, I have donated a breeding to my top full Accoyo herd sire. I am a firm believer that we need to stick together and help our fellow Alpaca farms in times of distress, whether they be competitors or not. He has high quality animals, but a small herd that makes any loss a big one.
Yes, chose your LGD, build your fences well, sight your guns in and help those who have had losses any way you can.

Charlie Mayo
Ohio Valley/tri-state area Oh,Ky,Wv
CharlieM87@aol.com
http://www.alpacanation.com/farmsandbreeders/03_viewfarm.asp?name=13716

WillowTan

592 Posts

Posted - 02/05/2008 :  9:39:34 PM  Show Profile  Visit WillowTan's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Charlie,

That is HORRIBLE. Thank you for sharing. What an awful situation to come home to.
Hats off to you for your care and concern, and willingness to help them by donating a breeding.
I will forever be grateful to everyone who came forward with thoughts and kind words and donations for the "reward fund" when I lost my cria, Arianne.

I now have three Guardian dogs that have access to all pastures. One Komondor ( I LOVE this dog), and two Maremma puppies that are learning quickly...but we also have a rifle on hand, and neighbors that keep a close eye for any strangers (human or k-9)


Tana L. Ward
WillowTan Alpacas
A Small Farm With Strong Values!
Delavan, WI 53115 http://alpacanation.com/willowtanalpacas.asp
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Hagen Heights Alpacas

995 Posts

Posted - 02/05/2008 :  11:00:09 PM  Show Profile  Visit Hagen Heights Alpacas's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I am horrified- how can we help?







quote:
Originally posted by Country Roads Alpacas

All joking aside now. I know he wouldn't want me to write this but I am anyway.

Shenoah Farm Alpacas, http://www.alpacanation.com/farmsandbreeders/03_viewfarm.asp?name=12477
just lost a 3/4 Accoyo full Peruvian male to a neighbors Pit Bull. He saw the dog there and payed no attention to it thinking it would not come back after he ran it off, and he didn't want to hurt the dog. The next day, his wife called him at work to tell him the dog came back and got into the pasture and literally took the head off an outstanding male of theirs. She shot at it and scared it off. The muzzle was gone and the hide and ears were stripped off the head leaving nothing but a muzzle-less skull and eyeballs. Their top full Accoyo stud had his legs chewed up also. He came home and put the scalped and muzzle-less male down. The next day, he stayed home to find the owner of the dog. The dog showed up again to finish the herd and he shot it with a shot gun, but the dog ran off and it is uncertain the bird shot did any real damage. He found the owner of the dog whom he said told him someone stole the dog and that he was so gentle that he would not harm a flee. The guy is said to have tore the please report up and attacked him as he was entering the vehicle and kicked him in the neck. He said the police knew the guy from the fire department and that he was a nice guy. They said it would only be a misdemeanor and not worth pursuing.
Folks, coyotes are not the threat. It is the neighbors pets. You can not allow them on your property. In an effort to help, I have donated a breeding to my top full Accoyo herd sire. I am a firm believer that we need to stick together and help our fellow Alpaca farms in times of distress, whether they be competitors or not. He has high quality animals, but a small herd that makes any loss a big one.
Yes, chose your LGD, build your fences well, sight your guns in and help those who have had losses any way you can.

Charlie Mayo
Ohio Valley/tri-state area Oh,Ky,Wv
CharlieM87@aol.com
http://www.alpacanation.com/farmsandbreeders/03_viewfarm.asp?name=13716



Todd Gruenhagen and Theresa Reyes-Stassel
Hagen Heights Alpaca Farm
Pine Bush, NY
845-733-5753
www.alpacanation.com/hagenheights.asp
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fererro

59 Posts

Posted - 02/06/2008 :  10:24:19 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
We had a similar problem with dogs at our house. 2 German Shepards came in & killed 4 of our alpacas & severly injured 2. My husband came home in the middle of the killings & was able to shoot & kill one of the dogs. The other got away. We did find the owner of the dogs, but she said that she used to have 2 german shepards, but that she had given one away to someone a couple weeks earlier. We were unable to do anything to the owner, because the dog that my husband killed was not microchipped, so we couldn't prove that it was hers, even though all her neighbors said that they were. We are big animal lovers, but one thing we learned from this. Any large dog that comes onto our property will not leave. We have our acreage fenced for a reason, to keep the dogs off.

Lisa Fererro
Big River Alpacas
Dittmer Mo
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Country Roads Alpacas

395 Posts

Posted - 02/06/2008 :  10:39:52 AM  Show Profile  Visit Country Roads Alpacas's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Hi all,

It does seem that dogs do the killing. I am sure there have been coyote kills, bit I haven't heard of one.

If I were looking for an animal, I would take a hard look at those who had loses first. I am not needing one now, but if I did, I would sure give those people my business, or at least talk to them about what they have. I am sure they would like to hear some encouragement from anyone who wants to E-mail them. They are super nice people. I know that if the people would have said they didn't have the money to compensate him for the loss, he would have forgiven it. He is that kind of person. Instead, the owner acted just like his dog.

Charlie Mayo
Ohio Valley/tri-state area Oh,Ky,Wv
CharlieM87@aol.com
http://www.alpacanation.com/farmsandbreeders/03_viewfarm.asp?name=13716
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hollimeier

5 Posts

Posted - 02/06/2008 :  12:15:50 PM  Show Profile  Visit hollimeier's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I occaisionally read forum posts. I've never responded before, but this topic prompted me to register and respond.

My story:
We (my husband, myself and three children, ages 10,8 and 3) have been in the alpaca 'business' for one year. While it is a business, it is so much more for us...it is a way of life, a way of reconnecting with what is important, a way of raising our children to become responsible adults in this crazy world that we live in. We have a small herd, currently 7 alpacas and 1 llama. On August 25, a beautiful sunny day, our nightmare happened. In the middle of the afternoon, a dog attacked our herd, killing our 2 crias. One cria was an orphan that we had purchased from another wonderful farm. We bottle fed this baby 4 times a day. My three-year old daughter sang to her cria, talked to her, tried to play with her and make sure she was happy and safe. In one afternoon, my dream world ended. I questioned everything that we had worked so hard for. I came very close to selling everything and moving back to a "normal" life. I had failed in the alpaca business. I had failed to protect my animals, the helpless crias that I was responsible for. Yes, I thought that I had done everything right...five foot fences, gates with extra rails at the bottom, guard llama, etc...but yet, I still had failed to protect my animals. And I had failed to protect my children from the heartache and grief that followed. My eight-year old son is still afraid to go outside at night. My daughter slept in our room for 3 months. We all panic at the sight of a strange dog or even the bark of the dog that seems too close. The financial loss was almost more than I could handle. My husband is incredibly supportive of this lifestyle, but it's not actually his thing. Yet through it all, it was my husband who insisted that we not give up. We are slowly moving ahead. We have a farm logo. I'm working on our website, I'm planning for shows in the spring and new crias. But I'm still full of doubt. I lack the confidence in knowing that I can successfully raise and protect these beautiful animals.

So why did I share my story? Because of what happened after this attack. We live in Michigan. There is a dog law (1919 PA 339, "Dog law of 1919") to protect livestock from dog attacks. However, this law was written in 1919 and does not included alpacas! We talked to an attorney and I've researched this law. Alpacas (and llamas) are not considered livestock in the state of Michigan for this specific law. I assume that other states also have similar loopholes and alpaca owners lack legal protection...against dogs and who know what else. We need to work together to change such laws to include our animals. I have talked to a state representative and they are working to amend the law - but because of a group of deer farmers, who also are not covered by the law! Check with your state. Make sure that your animals are protected by the law. We suffered such a huge emotional and financial loss. And then to discover that we could not even legally shoot the dog that attacked our herd...Let's do all that we can to protect our animals, our lifestyle, our dreams.

Holli
Wind Crest Alpaca Ranch
Tustin, MI

Edited by - hollimeier on 02/06/2008 12:19:38 PM
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box cars

534 Posts

Posted - 02/06/2008 :  6:38:26 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Holli, very sad I feel for you and your family. I also live in Mich. and any dog on my fence line that looks like trouble is a dead dog, law or know law my alpacas come first. I don't like to be like that but some times you just got to do what you got to do. The best to you and your family.
Ken

Ken & Pat Humbert
Pondview Alpaca Ranch
5088 Booth Rd.
China, Mi. 48054
N-42.73 W-82.51
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Country Roads Alpacas

395 Posts

Posted - 02/06/2008 :  10:32:56 PM  Show Profile  Visit Country Roads Alpacas's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Hi again,

It would be good if we as an association, could pay an small amount in each year to be used for predator losses that are confirmed. Wouldn't amount to much money each, but would be much much less than paying the high prices to insure each alpaca. Sort of a fund like the Pension benefit guarantee Corporation where $1 per employee was the cost. I would be willing to pay $20 a year for such a fund that helped people with predatory losses.

Charlie Mayo
Ohio Valley/tri-state area Oh,Ky,Wv
CharlieM87@aol.com
http://www.alpacanation.com/farmsandbreeders/03_viewfarm.asp?name=13716
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lakeside alpaca farm

24 Posts

Posted - 02/12/2008 :  6:19:04 PM  Show Profile  Visit lakeside alpaca farm's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Until recently, Maine had a similar law on the books. Alpacas and llamas were not considered livestock. A hunter shot a penned llama and said he thought it was a deer. Because the law didn't protect the rights of the llama the hunter, only had his gun taken away (temporarily)and that was because he was drunk with a firearm. The Maine Alpaca Association, with the help of a Senator, presented a bill to the Legislature stating alpacas and llamas are indeed livestock. On the day of the hearing alpaca and llama breeders came out to testify and the bill was unanimously passed. I am proud to say that alpacas and llamas are now considered livestock and are protected under the law. The Maine Alpaca Association also helped to define Livestock Guard Dogs. In the town we lived in at the time, there was a barking dog law and we own a Great Pyrenees (we now have two)who protects our herd. We were fined and fought the fine with the help of the MAA and now, "working" dogs are allowed to bark to protect their herd. We have to make the lawmakers take us seriously and protect our herds and LGDs.

Frank & Geri Gabriel
Lakeside Alpaca Farm
Thorndike, ME
lksdalpacas@dishmail.net
www.lakesidealpacafarm.com
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vintagealpacas

701 Posts

Posted - 02/12/2008 :  8:00:34 PM  Show Profile  Visit vintagealpacas's Homepage  Reply with Quote
So sad.... I feel your pain .... all of you who have suffered through dog (preditory) attacks on your alpacas.... I don't live at my farm and the farm is in a very risky area. Lots of neighborhood dogs, wild dogs at the land fill adjoining my property, and lots of people around that bring their dogs for walks and enjoy looking at the alpacas from behind the fence. I fear dog attacks too ... however, I have found trust and faith in my 2 great pyrenees dogs that roam freely over the farm property (12 acres). I have seen the carnage left behind after the pyr dogs are done with a preditor... mine have killed MANY MANY different animals that came onto the farm, no dogs yet, but I pitty the poor dog that wants to tangle with 2 great pyrs. Breeders... please get yourselves some LIVESTOCK GUARDIAN DOGS as they have instincts beyond what humans could ever hope for... great pyrs can smell, see, and sense danger .. they are nocturnal... they are ALWAYS on patrol even in their sleep they are listening to the sounds of the farm. They are the best protection anyone could ask for... I can't understand why you would be without a LGD dog with such valuable and helpless animals.

Kim Rassi
Vintage Alpacas

Kimberly Rassi
Vintage Alpacas
alpacanation.asp/vintage
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Christiane

2799 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2008 :  1:45:16 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I got my Anatolian Shepherd as soon as my neighbors told me that they had seen coyotes outside my pasture fences. More than one neighbor told the that they had seen them, so I know, although I have not seen them, they are around. Other neighbors who have farms a mile down the road, told me that there are packs of them around. So I started to research LSG breeds, and although I have always loved the Great Pyrs I saw at shows, I opted for an Anatolian Shepherd because of the ease of care of her coat. I sleep well at night, knowing that she is constantly on the prowl. Not even a cat gets by her. She also keeps the herds of deer that live in the woods behind my house out of the pastures.

I would strongly encourage anyone who raises alpacas in areas with predators, to get a LSG asap. My dog's brother, who is on my friend's alpaca farm, recently killed several coy dogs that had jumped into a pasture with "no climb fencing". The dog warden, when contacted, just replied that they were wild animals and nothing could be done about them. They are protected as "wild life".

Christiane Rudolf
Tanglewood Farm
19741 Victory Lane
Fayetteville, Ohio 45118
(513) 875-3739
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meadowlarkalpacas

22 Posts

Posted - 02/25/2008 :  10:35:41 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I'm sorry to read about another dog attack. My entire herd was killed on October 30, 2006 by four neighbor dogs. I had everything that everyone has talked about for protection. I have 5 foot high non climb fence, good gates, I had 2 guard llamas, two Maremma livestock guard dogs, I brought the alpacas and llamas up to the barnyard every night instead of leaving them out in the pasture and I still lost all of them. I had 9 alpacas and 2 325 pound guard llamas. The dogs that killed my herd were 1 Bullmastiff, 2 Bullmastiff/black lab mixes, and 1 pit bull. The three sheriffs officers, two veterinarians, the animal control officer and the neighbors who came over that day were horrified. They still talk about it to this day as the worst thing they have ever seen including the murders and car accidents they have seen. I was devastated, suicidal at times, depressed, etc. for the past 15 months while I fought with the insurance company that covered the rental house the dog owners live in. The dog owners still live there, I drive by their house twice a day on my way to and from work, I look at their house every time I drive by to make sure they haven't gotten any more dogs. If they ever do I'm not sure what I will do.
My point is, don't make the mistake of thinking your dogs can protect against several dogs at once. My dogs were just under 2 years old so they were immature and couldn't have fought off these four dogs. The dogs would have killed them too if they wouldn't have hid in the barn. Don't make the mistake of thinking a guard llama can protect against several dogs. They can't. They are just as much victims as the alpacas. Yes they have size but they can't defend themselves against a group of dogs. Fencing is great but not enough. Put fence on your gates to completely cover the gates and even go up past the top of the gates. I had fencing on the gates but only about 2/3rds of the way up. These four dogs went OVER my gates. Now my fencing goes above the top of the gates. I'm not even sure that will deter dogs like these. Electric fence wouldn't have stopped these dogs. They would have gone through it. They climbed three gates to get to my boys. Then they went through another fence to get to the girls. They were very determined.
I am rebuilding my herd thanks to a lot of very nice, supportive, understanding people. I was going to quit the alpaca business too. I had failed, I felt all those feelings too of guilt, sadness, depression, anger, etc. But for the past 15 months I was empty, and I finally figured out why. I love the alpacas, I miss them, I can't give them up. I am honest about what happened to me because I want people to learn from it. I hope it scares someone enough to go check your gates, put more fencing on them, shoot the stupid dogs when they're at your farm the first time. NO SECOND CHANCES!!!! They will come back. They will kill the rest of the herd if they get a chance.
I don't have my new alpacas at my farm yet but I have made some changes. I have a barn camera now that has infrared and audio so I can monitor the alpacas at night. I'm going to lock my alpacas in the barn at night so they are safe. I am also going to buy a shot gun. A dog on my property from now on is going to be a dead dog. The neighbors know it and support it. My maremmas are older now and much more aggressive. I still don't think they could defend against four dogs like those four but I'm convinced that they will kill now. I am also going to work to change the laws in Shawnee County. People should not be allowed to own more than one of those breeds of dogs. In town people who own pit bulls have to get special training. The county requires nothing.
I know this is long but I hope someone will take this information and learn from it. Domestic dogs are a huge threat.
Diane
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ard

1819 Posts

Posted - 02/26/2008 :  02:11:54 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Diane,
I remember your loss. We have a perimiter dog that is agressive toward strange animals. I don't know how she would be with a pack of dogs, though. We tell all of our customers that their worst problem is domestic dogs. I don't believe in killing anything, but I would kill a dog attacking my alpacas in a heartbeat.

Robin Alpert
Alpacas 'R Diamonds
15163 W 323rd
Paola, KS 66071
913-849-3738
www.alpacanation.com/alpacasrdiamonds.asp
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janechristie

1475 Posts

Posted - 02/26/2008 :  08:04:52 AM  Show Profile  Visit janechristie's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Hi Diane,

Thanks for sharing your story again, when it must be difficult for you to even think about it. It still amazes me that your local county did not demand that those dogs be destroyed. Apart from the obvious risk they pose to livestock, next time, it could be a child.

We sold two young males to a new breeder living about 5 miles away from our farm. They have fences, and they had penned guard dogs on the premises. Their land backs onto a large area of woodland, which leads down to the James River. They came home from dinner one evening to find the first two alpacas born to their farm (4 and 6 months old), and a recently purchased heavily pregnant female, dead, torn apart and partially consumed. One of the young males that originally came from our farm, was severely injured - missing large chunks of flesh from his back legs - but he did survive the attack, after a massive effort by his new owners, and I don't doubt, the vet's bill from Hell.

The local animal control wrote it up as "wild dog attack" and it looked as if the attackers dug their way in from underneath the fencing. To this day, we don't know if it was coyotes, who are in the area, or neighborhood dogs. We have several guns in the house, and my husband sighted his new rifle in at 30-40 yards just last weekend. Our neighbors are aware that if their hunting dogs come onto our property unaccompanied, they will be shot. Fortunately, in this area, we have the right to shoot any dog that worries our livestock.

We also have three Great Pyrenees livestock guard dogs who live with our alpacas 24X7. The 2 pups are less than a year old, so we could not rely on them to fend off a predator, let alone a pack of carnivores, but for the time being, their barking at least gives notice that they are inside the fences and will be a force to be reckoned with in due course. Our adult female LGD is worth her weight in gold - she guards our alpacas and our poultry from ground and air attack.

It was after reading heartbreaking accounts such as yours, Diane, that we realised one LGD was not enough to protect against a multiple predator attack, and that we were putting her life in danger by leaving her without back-up. Thank you, for bringing this to everyone's attention, so the danger does not go unnoticed.

Jane.

www.thistledownalpacas.com
Ph: (804)-784-4837 Fax: (804)-784-4839

Edited by - janechristie on 02/26/2008 11:17:39 AM
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johnson

219 Posts

Posted - 02/26/2008 :  3:38:21 PM  Show Profile  Visit johnson's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Ok everybody. I am convinced. We need guard dogs.

I have a bunch of stuff budgeted for this year but I am going to retro fit it now to include 2 LGD.

Can any of you point me in the correct direction of a reputable breeder of LGD? We live in Pennsylvania.

Which is best, GP or Maremma ? I would want to purchase them as puppies.



Craig Johnson
Worthington Acres Alpacas
Unityville, Pa.
ff1730@dishmail.net
www.alpacanation.com/worthingtonacres.asp
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MoonSuri

282 Posts

Posted - 02/26/2008 :  4:29:27 PM  Show Profile  Visit MoonSuri's Homepage  Send MoonSuri a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
Craig, you can look right here and see lots of LGDs in the classified ads that have been raised and trained with alpacas.

Just mentioning the word Meadowlark saddens me and makes me furious. Because of Diane and her tragedy, we have all made attempts to plan for an attack. At my farm, I installed 8 foot StayTite fencing and gates, with 12 foot wooden posts to make sure the fence won't buckle. Now that the snowdrifts have covered the top of the fence at one point (wow!) I have to shut them in at night. I wouldn't have been able to sleep knowing that coyotes could walk right over the fence, jump the internal 5' fencing and right into their pens. These are the sad things about having alpacas. But we all just do everything we can think of and hope for the best. I know I need to get LGDs, too.

Diane, thank you again for sharing your story. We are all pulling for you.

God bless,
Ruth


Ruth McNitt
Moonstruck Alpacas
Brandon, Iowa
email: moonstruckalpacas@yahoo.com
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vintagealpacas

701 Posts

Posted - 02/26/2008 :  8:12:20 PM  Show Profile  Visit vintagealpacas's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Try Shellie Greyhavens at Blackhavens Farm. 740-592-1073. My AKC GP male did a stud job for her last fall. The litter was very nice. My male has 7 AKC Champions in his line which is why he is doing stud work. Shellie is also doing a spring litter as well, not with my male (with her own), but she does run a reputable show over there. Her puppies are raised on the farm.

Is AKC necessary? Well, if you want pure blood Great Pyrenees I would say "YES"! If you want a mix breed you may not get the guardian instinct as strong... you may, but you may not.... why take a chance... do it right the first time!

Kim Rassi
Vintage Alpacas

Kimberly Rassi
Vintage Alpacas
alpacanation.asp/vintage
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meadowlarkalpacas

22 Posts

Posted - 02/26/2008 :  11:05:07 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I do appreciate everyone's support. It has been a horribly long road to get to the point that I can talk about the alpacas without getting depressed or cry. I did think I was going crazy but luckily I had the support of wonderful co-workers (I had just started a new job so they didn't know me any other way than sad about the alpacas), a great therapist and a great fiance. I would also like to publicly thank Nancy Sines of Cedar Hollow Farm Alpacas for keeping in constant contact with me for 15 long months, mostly by e-mail, but always "listening" to my grief and trauma. I know it had to be hard for her but she was always there.

The one thing I want from my tragedy is for people to take domestic dogs seriously and not underestimate them. They can do more damage than a wild animal. A wild animal usually kills to eat. Domestic dogs kill for the thrill. I am very happy that people are being pro-active about their fencing, LGD's and other protection. That means my kids didn't die in vane. That's important to me.

The four dogs who were responsible were killed. One was still in my pasture when the sheriff's officers, animal control and veterinarians showed up. That dog was shot by the sheriff. I wish I could have shot it but the gun they used would have knocked me flat. The other three dogs were picked up from inside the owners house where they were let in with blood on them. The owners said they knew the dogs had "gotten into something". I'm trying very hard not to hate the dog owners. That will only hurt me in the end.

I don't think any specific breed of LGD is "better" than the rest. Just get a purebred. If they're mixed they might not "guard" as well as a purebred. Make sure you let your dogs grow up before you expect much out of them as far as protection. They are all big dogs and take a little longer to mature. My dogs were 23 months old, and severely traumatized by the ordeal. The only thing that healed their trauma was getting some Angora goats to guard. Now they are very aggressive and I'm not even sure I would trust them to not bite a person. Find a breeder who raises their puppies with livestock. That helps with their natural instinct.

I am very happy to be back in the alpaca business. You are all good people and I've missed being a part of the community. When I didn't think I would ever be able to get back in the alpaca business I mourned the loss of the alpacas and the loss of the friends and sense of community that I had. Healing is a wonderful thing. I considered changing the name of the farm but decided to keep Meadowlark as a tribute to my original alpacas. It was successful with them and I hope it will be successful in the future.

Diane
Meadowlark Alpacas
Topeka, Kansas
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Snowleopard

33 Posts

Posted - 03/09/2008 :  5:12:13 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Will multi-llamas (5 to 10) able to guard against multi-dogs attacking? Of course I am not sure if they can do well against single powerful pit bu

Glenn
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meadowlarkalpacas

22 Posts

Posted - 03/12/2008 :  9:15:34 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
My opinion is just based on my experience which I don't think was "normal" thank goodness. If I would have had 5-10 llamas with my herd that night those dogs would have killed every one of them too unless the dogs got too tired to keep killing. I also truly believe that if those dogs hadn't barked and growled at me that morning in the dark and I would have gone in that barnyard before I got the gun they would have killed me too. But I don't think my experience is normal. I don't think those four dogs were "normal". I do think that a llama is excellent for an alert animal, not a "protector". Llamas might be able to stomp one or two dogs to death depending on the size and meanness of the dog but if there are several, big, bulky, strong, vicious dogs then the llamas will only be victims of the dogs along with the alpacas. My llamas were 325 pounds each. Dominique, the female llama, was laying along the fence just like the female alpacas. Bud, my gelding llama, fought long and hard but ultimately paid the price too. He was still alive the next morning but he was so badly mauled and chewed up we had to have him put to sleep 4 days later so he didn't suffer anymore. It also takes a very special llama to not run. Many llamas will run if there is danger present. I plan to get a female and gelding llama to be with my new herd but they will be for alarm purposes only.

Diane Creek
Meadowlark Alpacas
Topeka, Kansas
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Snowleopard

33 Posts

Posted - 03/16/2008 :  02:50:47 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
After I read that message that said Llama can not be 100 percent guard, that made me feel so bad as I keep wonder which one that are more than just alert animal. Of course, I do thinking of LGD as I often heard that they always barking. I guess I need to get trained dog to alert me inside house even while I asleep so I can get up to go outside. Hearing guide dog can be trains to tell me certain way to go check livestock like that. they can tell me that phone is ringing, door knocking, baby crying and other stuff.

One thing pop in my head while think so hard how keep attacking dog out. I have funny idea as I hope you find it so funny...dress up a scarecrow in dog catcher uniform plus long handle net. Got it?

Cheer
Glenn
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